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official numbers from China have half a million detainees listed, until they stopped publishing detainee information; most estimates agree that the number of uyghur detainees in total is closer to 2 million.
12 million uyghyrs / 2 million uyghur detainees, ~1 in 6 uyghurs have been or are still detained.
Close to everyone here has been asking you for sources. If you’re going to provide numbers, you need to provide sources. People like @RedWizard@hexbear.net have given you large, well-sourced and thoroughly documented comments, if you respond with “sources” like “it’s widely known” people are going to rightfully dismiss your claims.
In this entire thread, you’ve provided a podcast from The Economist, a British Propaganda outlet explicitly promoting free-market liberalism and demonizing any country that goes against Western Hegemony, not just China. You should slow down and actually respond to comments, if you can’t dignify questions with a proper response, then you can just not respond. Refraining from speaking on a subject you know less about is better than digging a deeper hole for yourself.
I repeat, it is better to not respond at all than it is to give a half-assed response. If your goal is to change people’s minds or show onlookers better arguments, providing weak and unsubstantial, unsourced arguments hurts both of those goals. Again, it is okay to not speak on subjects you aren’t educated on. Maybe use it as an opportunity to learn more yourself.
You haven’t sourced any of your “facts,” while you’ve been given many sources countering your claims. Extreme claims, such as claims of genocide, require proper evidence and sourcing, not just gesturing. Linking a podcast from a British propaganda outlet isn’t going to cut it, not only can people say quite literally whatever they want to in an interview, but podcasts are a time commitment when articles and direct sources can be parsed much quicker and more effectively.
I suggest you take a break, find some actual sources, and if you can’t, concede and use it as an opportunity for growth.
You provided a single podcast from a British propaganda outlet. Why not link the sources the podcast references, unless there are none? Is the podcast just a testemonial from 2 people, or does it contain a list of genuine sources that you can pull from?
Every other figure you’ve provided has gone unsourced, either you “heard it yourself” or claim it’s “from the government” without linking to the documents or statements these numbers must have come from, if you didn’t make them up.
Clicking through a few links eventually leads to this, which does appear to actually cite Chinese authorities. It shows arrests in Xinjiang spiking to around 230K in 2017. The paper is from 2018, so that’s the most recent data it has.
No data on how many arrests resulted in convictions, what kind of sentences were handed down, conditions of confinement, or anything that would take “they arrested a lot of people” to “they are doing a genocide.”
Certainly doesn’t support the figure of 2 million detainees they tossed around. The half a million arrests claim is at least in play, assuming the spike in arrests wasn’t one year only.
I read it, and it does not contain your claim. I can only conclude now that you know that and are deliberately being dishonest and hoping people won’t check if your sources actually say what you claim they say.
At any rate, until you can actually provide a source, any honest person can only conclude that your claim is baseless.
you want the 2 million estimates?
That article claims estimates of “800,000 to 2,000,000”, which actually contradicts your claim of “most estimates agree that the number of uyghur detainees in total is closer to 2 million.”
Could you please explain why you are still misrepresenting your sources?
Also, that article sources its claim to the US government, but the paper is links just drops the claim again with no source or justification. Where is this 2,000,000 number actually coming from?
where did you get this 1 in 6 number?
official numbers from China have half a million detainees listed, until they stopped publishing detainee information; most estimates agree that the number of uyghur detainees in total is closer to 2 million.
12 million uyghyrs / 2 million uyghur detainees, ~1 in 6 uyghurs have been or are still detained.
Close to everyone here has been asking you for sources. If you’re going to provide numbers, you need to provide sources. People like @RedWizard@hexbear.net have given you large, well-sourced and thoroughly documented comments, if you respond with “sources” like “it’s widely known” people are going to rightfully dismiss your claims.
there have been a lot of questions, I’ve supplied sources to the direct questions.
you may have missed them in the flurry of comments.
In this entire thread, you’ve provided a podcast from The Economist, a British Propaganda outlet explicitly promoting free-market liberalism and demonizing any country that goes against Western Hegemony, not just China. You should slow down and actually respond to comments, if you can’t dignify questions with a proper response, then you can just not respond. Refraining from speaking on a subject you know less about is better than digging a deeper hole for yourself.
I’m responding to all of your comments.
you are asserting that basic facts and interviews are propaganda.
I don’t see facts that way.
I repeat, it is better to not respond at all than it is to give a half-assed response. If your goal is to change people’s minds or show onlookers better arguments, providing weak and unsubstantial, unsourced arguments hurts both of those goals. Again, it is okay to not speak on subjects you aren’t educated on. Maybe use it as an opportunity to learn more yourself.
You haven’t sourced any of your “facts,” while you’ve been given many sources countering your claims. Extreme claims, such as claims of genocide, require proper evidence and sourcing, not just gesturing. Linking a podcast from a British propaganda outlet isn’t going to cut it, not only can people say quite literally whatever they want to in an interview, but podcasts are a time commitment when articles and direct sources can be parsed much quicker and more effectively.
I suggest you take a break, find some actual sources, and if you can’t, concede and use it as an opportunity for growth.
that’s why I’m providing corroborated, firsthand sources.
they’re probably in the other comments if you haven’t seen them yet.
if you need other sources for something specific in one of my comments, let me know.
You provided a single podcast from a British propaganda outlet. Why not link the sources the podcast references, unless there are none? Is the podcast just a testemonial from 2 people, or does it contain a list of genuine sources that you can pull from?
Every other figure you’ve provided has gone unsourced, either you “heard it yourself” or claim it’s “from the government” without linking to the documents or statements these numbers must have come from, if you didn’t make them up.
You haven’t shown a single corroborated anything and are huffily lying about it because you’re too scared to learn.
Source?
Source?
Xinjiang High people’s protectorate:
https://www.hrw.org/news/2022/09/14/china-xinjiang-official-figures-reveal-higher-prisoner-count
You seem to have posted the wrong link, that goes to the western NGO, HRW, not the Xinjiang High people’s protectorate
I would also like a source on:
Clicking through a few links eventually leads to this, which does appear to actually cite Chinese authorities. It shows arrests in Xinjiang spiking to around 230K in 2017. The paper is from 2018, so that’s the most recent data it has.
No data on how many arrests resulted in convictions, what kind of sentences were handed down, conditions of confinement, or anything that would take “they arrested a lot of people” to “they are doing a genocide.”
So the source doesn’t’ remotely back up their claim?
Certainly doesn’t support the figure of 2 million detainees they tossed around. The half a million arrests claim is at least in play, assuming the spike in arrests wasn’t one year only.
Well they didn’t claim half a million arrests, they claimed half a million in concentration camps.
That’s where they got the number, from the high people’s protectorate.
Not that I can find in the article. could you please quote the section?
I would also like a source on:
sorry, the articles only a few paragraphs along, try to read it a little more carefully.
or look for the older source that directly links to the protectorate, I have a lot of sources to provide.
you want the 2 million estimates?
here’s one:
https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/china-xinjiang-uyghurs-muslims-repression-genocide-human-rights
I read it, and it does not contain your claim. I can only conclude now that you know that and are deliberately being dishonest and hoping people won’t check if your sources actually say what you claim they say.
At any rate, until you can actually provide a source, any honest person can only conclude that your claim is baseless.
That article claims estimates of “800,000 to 2,000,000”, which actually contradicts your claim of “most estimates agree that the number of uyghur detainees in total is closer to 2 million.”
Could you please explain why you are still misrepresenting your sources?
Also, that article sources its claim to the US government, but the paper is links just drops the claim again with no source or justification. Where is this 2,000,000 number actually coming from?
You’re clearly not sorry for shit