So many people on this thread are defending leashes, yet they don’t exist anywhere but in the US, so…
I have never ever seen a kid leash in Denmark or any country I have visited, and yet kids here don’t run around in stores acting out or disappearing.
I don’t know, they seem dehumanizing and humiliating to me. If other countries can raise kids (incl kids on the spectrum) without them why can’t the US?
My guess is that the American working system has drained so much from their working population that leashes are required because they have no energy left to pay full attention to their children.
That, and streets are deadly hellscapes over there a lot of the time. Driving laws are barely enforced and infrastructure is almost like it’s intended to kill anyone who dares to exist outside a car.
Out of 75 million kids 200 per year are killed by vehicles. This is roughly on par, albeit slightly higher than top EU countries.
People rightfully look at you like you’re stupid when you make these statements that have nothing to do with reality. Get off the internet.
Child Pedestrian Fatalities per Million Children (under 15)
Country / Region Est. Fatalities/Year Child Pop. (0–14) Fatalities per Million
United States ~225 ~61 million ~3.7 United Kingdom ~22 ~11.5 million ~1.9 Canada ~12 ~6 million ~2.0 Australia ~11 ~4.8 million ~2.3 Germany ~20 ~11 million ~1.8 France ~18 ~11 million ~1.6 Japan ~18 ~15 million ~1.2 India ~3,000 (est.) ~360 million ~8.3 Brazil ~450 ~50 million ~9.0 European Union (EU-27) ~140–160 ~72 million ~2.0
Total EU child population (0–14): ~72 million
Result: ~2.1 deaths per million children
I’m not saying more kids die in traffic over there. I’m saying people have to be, and are, way more careful to keep their kids away from traffic.
The most common way children under 4 are hit by cars is not on the street but in driveways followed by parking lots.
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I’m 53 and have seen them used on different continents. My mom used one on me in Europe when we visited when I was two years old. You are completely wrong on all fronts with your comment. Have a good day.
Your American mum bringing a leash over and using it on you somewhere in Europe 51 years ago hardly makes me wrong on all fronts.
Funny you would assume I’m American. You are still wrong on all fronts.
Lemmy, like reddit, skews American and you’re referring to Europe as well, Europe, which tells me you’re not European. You’re welcome to correct me, of course.
Even if you’ve seen leashes on all continents, they’re definitely super rare and not common now. If you decide to be informative instead of assertive you are welcome to educate me on your experiences and expand on which fronts exactly I am wrong and why.
I see no need to waste my time explaining anything to a closed-minded person. Good day.
Thank you for not contributing with anything meaningful to the conversation, I guess!
They used to be quite common in the UK back in the 80s. Stops kids running into busy roads, and you can also use it to hold up an unsteady toddler.
Obviously you don’t use them on like eight year olds.
You don’t see them much any more.
Yea, I don’t get it. Reading this thread, the people seem insane to me. Yet they are all 100% up arrows.
It’s fuckin wild. I used to manage a toys department in an American burger big box store in a small town so I saw some shit. It’s either parents with kids on leashes or threatening them or hitting them in the aisle, my fellow Americans often treat their kids like shit, the image of the overindulgent parent isn’t really what you see around. Kids get treated like this and grow up to be adults who don’t break the cycle.
I’m not even from US (Asian) and i see them in my country from time to time, especially in mall. Why would you find it dehumanising when it’s merely something that tied to each other wrist? It’s not even tied to a neck or something, it’s just handholding with extra length. It sounds crazy to me that people actually dehumanising it then call it dehumanising.
I am not referring to a string you hold, I am referring to a leash like this:
I find them dehumanizing and humiliating because they remind me of a dog leash. Look, people parent differently across the world, I remember a British-Indian comedian who was married to a Dane who said that every parenting practice she regarded as healthy and appropriate was basically illegal in Denmark.
The leash will never not be weird to me, but it is what it is. I don’t think everyone who uses a leash is literally going to treat their kid like a dog, I know they probably love and cherish their kids like I cherish mine, but the fact remains that it feels off to me and I’d say most other people from my neck of the woods.
I can’t ever remember seeing a kid wearing them here in the UK but my grandma once said she used “reins” on my dad and his siblings which would have been from late 1960s to late 1970s.
Toddlers reins are super useful if they don’t want to go in a push chair and won’t hold hands.
They are for toddlers freedom, not control.
Me and my sister definitely had them in the early 80s. Kids are stupid, and the alternative is you strap them in a buggy if they can’t be trusted to walk.
They weren’t uncommon in the US in the '90s, they fell out of favor soon after. Even back then they weren’t popular.
In the '80s and earlier, corporal punishment was regular and expected. There was a push in the '90s to stop the corporal punishment. A lot of parents stopped handing out corporal punishment but failed to replace it with any form of discipline. It was not an uncommon to see kids tearing things off shelves yelling at and smacking their parents while their parents were going “now Jimmy, We don’t do that” shrinking at parents walking by saying their kids, what are you going to do?;The little backpacks with the leashes were a symptom of failed parenting. If you grew up in this time in a very conservative area you might not have experienced this yourself, as giving timeouts, redirecting, and not beating your kids as a relatively progressive ideal and when it started it was actively disparaged by conservatives.
In the '80s and earlier, corporal punishment was regular and expected. There was a push in the '90s to stop the corporal punishment.
Corporeal punishment was outlawed in Denmark by 1997, but was definitely frowned upon much earlier than that. My grandparent’s generation - born in the 1920s and 1930s - was likely the last generation where it was commonly used.
I mean, our kids can be little brats as well - and our kids are also prone to run off and do dumb stuff, but apparently we handle it differently. And I am fairly certain that my initial reaction - that it’s dehumanizing and humiliating - is how it comes off to almost all Nordic parents.
No, I’m explaining the timing. We went from it being acceptable to not doing it in a very short period of time. Delicious came out because parents couldn’t work out any way to control their kids but a physical means.
I’m well aware that Nordic countries treat their kids with a lot more dignity and freedom than the rest of the world, some might even say to their own detriment.
One of my co-workers expatriated to Sweden for a few years. There were tweens just hopping on the bus and going to the museum miles away. But I get the feeling that one could trust the average Swede would prevent harm to a child from a pedophile.
Leashes in the US were a symptom of a brisk change in society with relatively little information on how to perform it. They definitely existed.
One of my co-workers expatriated to Sweden for a few years. There were tweens just hopping on the bus and going to the museum miles away. But I get the feeling that one could trust the average Swede would prevent harm to a child from a pedophile.
In contrast to what many people think, Nordic people are fairly strict with what kids are allowed to do when they are small. We spend a lot of time and effort to ensure that kids are well behaved and can be trusted and don’t act out when they are small, and then, gradually, they are allowed more freedom as they grow older. By the time they’re young teenagers we generally feel like they’ve demonstrated that they can be trusted and they are often allowed to bike or take the bus around town and live with a lot more freedom.
Maybe you’re thinking “Duh, that’s how everyone does it!”, but the reason I mention it is that I’ve experienced that many cultures do it differenty; when the kids are young they are allowed a lot of freedom and very little responsibility, then as they grow older their parents will restrict them more and more. It’s pretty much the opposite of the Nordic approach.
We’re veering off course (or I am, at least), but I find the differences in parenting across cultures very fascinating.
One commenter said that the leashes are for safe toddler independence, not control, and I guess I can see that. It makes sense, even if it would be cultural taboo in my part of the world.
I’ve seen it once in Denmark actually. But it was a severely mentally challenged kid on a train station where the parents had them in a leash. Looked weird when you’re not used to it, but I guess I can understand that one use case.
I’ve seen one that basically is a top with a string coming from the back. I get it, kids are stupid and distractible
My grandma was a disabled stay-at-home mom with a hyperactive daughter who tended to run away and wreak havoc, and all the police would soon know who to return her to. Grandma was scolded by neighbors for using a leash but able to explain herself. This was in 1970s Czechoslovakia.
I watched as our little, barely walking toddler walked away from us in a busy department store. I followed behind, hiding behind racks, to see if he would get scared and turn around. Nope. Did not turn once. Just waddled away. I had to race and grab him from behind once he stepped onto the escalator.
It was then that I really understood the need for those leashes. Had a talk with the wife and we decided against it, but it was close.
🤣🤣🤣
I’m sure it was very real moment for you. I hope, therefore, that it wasn’t too cruel of me to laugh very loudly at the whole situation. Kids are… Special.
I saw a gif around here some time ago. A woman was walking with their kids. When the walked passed a car ready to unpark the kid ducked in front of it. No warning, no logic, just suicide attempt.
I’ve always felt weird about parents who have those backpack leashes for their kids, but now that I’ve been living next to my in-laws for a year, who have 8 children, I understand some of them.
I refuse to take some their kids anywhere unless one of them is with my wife and I.
One would absolutely go sprinting full speed away and hide from us just because he thinks it’s hilarious.
Two would wander off because they saw something shiny and their brains are like an etch-a-sketches where every time a new thought enters, the old one has to get wiped away.
One would do the exact opposite of anything we say just because he figures he can.
And three others would absolutely just wander off, not because they want to but just because kids aren’t always the best at spatial awareness and simply get too far away. And would be terrified if they noticed their adults were nowhere in sight.
You lost a kid. That’s only 7
In fairness, that’s why I feel like getting a leash.
Plus the oldest is 13 and at least she’s responsible enough for us to look away for a few minutes and she will still be there.
I feel like this could be an attention problem. 8 is too many kids not to have serious help keeping a family running.
Also it sounds a bit like idiocracy if they can’t learn to fucking stay near an adult. Future Darwin Award contestants maybe?
My son was shy, but he hid from us a couple times. But he was taught from as soon as he could understand that wandering from mom and dad (or uncles or grandparents) was a bad idea. But he’s also an only child and has said some pretty weirdly mature things. He scolds me for putting marker caps in my mouth and makes sure I have all relevant PPE when we’re working in the shop for instance, and he’s been doing it since he was 4-5.
The last one wouldn’t look both ways before crossing a street…
Your kid won’t look both ways before crossing a street? That’s a paddlin’.
My mom would just walk away as if she didn’t even have a kid with her. The panic and fear of losing my mom and having to find her again in a huge ass grocery store is what eventually kept me close from some point on
Nowadays that mom would get arrested for neglect or some bullshit.
Having that many children is child abuse. There’s no way they all get the parental attention they need.
Oh completely 100% agreed, and neglect isn’t the only form of child abuse going on but CPS has visited them plenty of times and interviewed all the kids and neighbors (before we moved in) over custody battles with some adopted ones. (they’re all related, long story with too many identifying details but some parents died and all the children are cousins and siblings) so they at least aren’t doing anything that CPS cares about.
But holy shit I have never wanted to curb stomp my sister in law a-la American History X more than when I went over one day and I could hear screaming halfway down the 1/4mi driveway, and when I walked in she was in the 6 year Olds face screaming at the top of her lungs about how she’s tired of telling the 6 year old to put her shoes away, four of the kids were slowly doing chores in the living room and kitchen with tears running down their faces, and I could hear the 13 year old sobbing upstairs. Their mother screamed so hard and long that she burst a blood vessel in her eye and detached the retina. As usual though the moment she saw me she stopped and pretended like she wasn’t doing anything.
Since then I’ve had my phone on record in my pocket whenever I’m coming over unannounced just in case I can catch it. Bare minimum it will be something to show the courts when one of the kids becomes a serial killer.
Their dad is no help, he’s an enabler and honestly a broken shell of a person when it comes to his wife.
Grandparents are worse than parents.
My wife watches them whenever she can, and takes them on surprise day trips to get away from their parents and some of the siblings when possible but holy shit they do not make it easy to take them anywhere.
I don’t regret marrying my wife but I can honestly say my in-laws are insane and anyone could understand why I hate them.
Uhhhhhhh what was the topic again? Sorry for the vent.
Thank you for sharing your story. The child abusers downvoting us need to see the gritty reality.
My parents sucked but I’m grateful they at least didn’t leash me like a dog. They degraded me enough already.
My brother was leashed, but he would also run into traffic and chase animals if you let him.
I can remember being on one. I used to use it to pull against my mom all the time and she was scared that if she let me off it I would run away. I didn’t run away.
Do you remember Harambe?!!! Harambe died for your pride! If that boy was in a leasg he would still be here and the world would be a better place. /s but not really?!
Seriously now, leashing a kid is not a bad thing. Young kids will run faster than light and human parents can avoid accidents, make sure the kid is is around.and shop without losing their minds. Let’s normalize it. If you use a necklace, is that a collar? No. Leave moms alone
That kid got into a gorilla enclosure. He could have figured out the clasp on a leash.
A necklace doesn’t inhibit movement but okay.
most kid leashes are on backpacks, not around the neck lol
A collar is not a leash
There are kids with behavioural issues or kids on the spectrum, it doesn’t mean they or the parents are bad people. I never agreed with the kid leash and still don’t use it but after 3 years with an autistic toddler, I don’t blame anyone for using them. Would you rather that child be running lose or running circles around you? Don’t criticize people’s parenting, especially if you don’t know their situation or have never raised a special needs child.
It gave us a little peace of mind when our autistic child was a toddler. He had just started eloping and he was very fast and very sneaky. Holding his hand wasn’t always feasible and we wanted to encourage some freedom and independence so a backpack with a tether was a good option, especially in crowded areas. He was free to explore something if it interested him but the gentle tug gave him enough physical feedback to understand that he needed to stay close to us. Now that he’s older we can just verbally remind him to stay close if he starts wandering off.
“This leash demeans us both”
“This leash isn’t for their protection, it is for your protection”
ITT: people who doesn’t have kids, doesn’t interact with kids, or doesn’t have to raise a particularly difficult kids, talks about raising kids.
OOP sounds like an insufferable person tbh.
As a parent of a special needs child we currently leash when attending large events (he is a flight risk) I would laugh so hard if someone asked me if he’s a rescue
I was a leash kid
Tell us about how it molded your personality
The leash was fine.
The choke chain really had an effect though.
I don’t remember it at all. I have ADHD which may be related to why they got me a leash.
I was just about to say this. The kids are likely special needs or neurodivergent.
I’m more curious if they have a leash for the bedroom.
I got this thing online that has four straps connected together and you put it under your mattress with the ends of the straps sticking out and you can strap someone to the bed. Since you asked.
I also have those, would recommend
Drop that Amazon link bb
“under bed restraints” is what you’re looking for, I don’t feel like digging up the link for my exact ones from years ago lol
Thx qt pi
I bought mine from an online store called The Stockroom
(Apologies. Got a little excited there.)
EDIT: Just realized little Jesus had to watch what went on last night.
Hypothesis still valid, we need more data
Very handy in hotel room mattress as well, for light, not heavy, play. Love that you responded in earnest btw. I hear it’s important to be earnest.
Ah, that explains it…
Me too. And my son.
Excuse me what the fuck? A human being on a leash like a dog?
What is this, how to destroy a child’s dignity with one weird trick?
It’s usually for the kid’s safety. Little kids especially run off sometimes; and while it’d be nice to be able to be a continuously attentive parent, sometimes you need to get shit done out and about while they’re with you. Sometimes they’re fine with just being carried or sitting in a shopping cart, but if not, a leash & harness (usually just integrated into a backpack) lets them wander safely while you take care of what you’re there to do.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a kid older than 4 or so in one.
I remember being on one of those. They were fairly common in the 80s. I also deserved it because I was a little shit that would sprint away at the first opportunity in the grocery store.
This leash demeans us both
“Timmy want a cookie? Timmy want a cookie? Good boy!”
Dammit dad, I’m 5!
“Timmy want a lootbox?”
Timmy want robux?
Yes, you know he does.
High five! I’m dad
People are alluding to it, but not attributing the blame correctly: the “need” to leash kids is yet another negative consequence of car-dependent urban design.
The fuck are you on about? Have you never had a kid disappear on you in a mall? There’s no cars there
Multiple people in the thread are talking about using them because of worries about a kid running out into traffic.
Quit pretending that a statement has to apply 100% of the time in every possible circumstance in order to be generally true.
It was a disconnected and incoherent thought, but I’ll give it a pass because in America we really do seem to be doing everything possible to make our neighborhoods as lethal as possible.
As for leaches on children, I guess it’s they’re used in some medical cases like reattached limbs that need blood-flow, but leaches are kind of gross and don’t serve much good besides those few examples, so I don’t know why we’re trying to use them again on children in particular.
Are chained kids particularly difficult to raise, more so than before (and than kids in any other culture besides the one that puts leashes on their kids…)? Were people doing this 100 years ago in America, for instance? Or is it yet another example of social decay, that parents can’t even discipline/raise their kids well enough to allow them outside without leashes?
What an ignorant comment. There’s evidence to suggest walking attachment devices for young children were used way back in the 17th century. It’s possible that similar things were used earlier than that too. An early version of the modern one we are all familiar with now, started selling in the 1920s. Incidentally, use of it skyrocketed as more and more cars, faster cars and busier roads spread across the modern world.
And another thing, use of these leashes is common for parents of kids with disabilities. I have to use one with my son because his learning difficulties mean that he doesn’t understand danger and if he gets frightened/overwhelmed he will often run away in a panic.
I don’t like using it but I would rather have my disabled son safe and alive than not use it, and judgemental attitudes like this are the reason that I have to put up with unsolicited, nasty comments when I take him out in public; when I’m already dealing with the stress of keeping a child with extra supervisory needs safe and well.
My autistic son would happily play in the park. Just once every few months he would decide that “now is the time to run” and just take off as fast as he could in a straight line. How would that play out in a busy street.
People can’t imagine that: so much of the time things are calm, straightforward to handle, but if EVER you let your guard down for a second at the wrong time, you’ll end up on the news as a “tragic story of grieving negligent parent.”
Yup, sounds exactly like my kiddo too. And they are FAST.
It really feels like damned if you do, and damned if you don’t and something happens to them.
As you said, he’s disabled. I have a trisomic uncle and I would’ve understood if he was put on a leash (he wasn’t, he just listened to my grandpa, but not everyone has it so easy). I don’t understand the need for it in other cases. I mean, two of my friends’ kids are runners and all we do is just run with them and grab them when the time is done, they/we have never had any need for a leash. I’m sorry if people have harassed you about it though, I certainly wouldn’t. I just voice my questions and opinions in voluntarily attended online spaces.
Or is it yet another example of social decay, that parents can’t even discipline/raise their kids well enough to allow them outside without leashes?
From what I’ve heard, the expectations of behavior for children in public spaces has gotten a lot more strict. People generally have very little patience for your kid’s antics. Also fewer mothers are dedicated homemakers, and when time and energy are tight, a leash might be a good bandaid.
People having little patience for children is yet another example/consequence of social decay. Imagine being a grown adult and treating kids with anything but playful kindness…
I think it’s more the fact that kids weren’t really brought to busy markets/stores 100 years ago, nor were there busy streets full of cars everywhere. They stayed home or just in the local environment, and typically mom would also stay home to watch them and make sure they stayed out of trouble.
So, in the West (again, I doubt we’re talking about 100 years ago in India), people were socialized like that until recently? They weren’t going to parks and markets? Mmm. That’s possible, I guess? I somehow doubt that to be true, but I’ll take your word for it because I’m too lazy to do otherwise. 😅
Kids are incapable of resisting their urge to do something to a certain degree at certain ages. Like suddenly running onto the street for example. Some kids just do this, and then your only option to keep them safe is a leash.
I literally have never seen a kid on a leash IRL (I’m not American) nor heard anyone say “goddamn this kid is so hard to raise, lemme put him on a leash”. Never seen a pic of my gramps on a leash, or a history book showing leashed kids. Through millennia kids have been properly raised without leashes. So, I ask again, is this not just another example of how incompetent people have gotten at being people in some areas of the world?
It’s barely a thing. Some parents with special-needs kids or parents with a lot to juggle in places like amusement parks sometimes use leashes or backpack-leads to keep their very young kids close, but nobody actually cares much, nobody is actually shamed, nobody laughs and points, nobody gives it a second glance.
This is the kind of thing that’s played up for laughs or memed about because it’s objectively a funny concept depending on context, but don’t get lost down the rabbit-hole of internet users overthinking every goddamn thing and making everything into an issue.
Just spitballing here, but I kinda wonder if modern tech isn’t worsening children’s impulse control. Having constant instant gratification surely has some negative effects on it.
Anecdotal evidence here, but my friends who are parents cut way back on how much tech time their kids got, and they said there was a huge improvement in their general behaviour.
This isn’t an issue, it’s used by some parents with very small children in busy areas like amusement parks or if they have special needs, but hardly anyone actually cares outside of comedy skits. Nobody actually feels shame or anything. It’s played up for laughs.
There’s like 20% of every Lemmy/Reddit post about things like this from people who are thinking WAY too hard about things.
