I’ve never understood LatinX. Is it supposed to be a gender neural Latino/Latina? I’m only a Spanish beginner but I’m fairly sure Latino can be masculine and gender neutral.
“LatinX” was indeed the first attempt at a gender neutral description. “Latino” is still considered by many native speakers to be “neutral”, but the most feasible solution I’ve seen popping up is the “latine” (as in “estudiante”, “vigilante”, etc). Since it uses an explicitly non-gendered suffix, it is more correctly inclusive than the “latino”. It will take a while though, und until it is really widely adopted.
“Latino” is still considered by many native speakers to be “neutral”
So like, is there any sizeable Latin community actually calling for a gender neutral term or is this just a middle-class white people thing? Because as a white person I’ve never seen anyone push for this other than white people and it just seems like a white savior/ daddy knows best thing. But my experience is just my experience
There are some people who identify as Latinx. Pew puts it at 2-3% of Latin Americans, usually those who are non-binary.
I think the reason that it has the astroturfed white middle class vibe is that it’s really been pushed by corporate culture for whatever reason, who use it as catch all for all Latin Americans which clearly doesn’t line up with how the majority self-identify.
That is what I myself thought on the first place, but it’s more of a “global” movement. It’s not just “white people”, but rather also native Spanish speakers learning nuances of other languages, plus Gender Studies research, etc.
I don’t know where you come from or what languages (apart from English) you might speak, but:
“Latin” in Spanish means the same on English: Latin, as in the sense of the language spoken by the romans. I don’t think there is a single Spanish speaking country that calls latine “latin”.
Most languages (including Spanish) have gendered nouns. German even has 3. Swedish has 2 (although those are “common” and “neutral”.
Language evolves with time. It’s not “professors teaching new words”, it’s actually society coming up with new words. The Swedish even got themselves (relatively recently) a new third person pronoun noun specifically for a neutrally gendered/ungendered person. It is now part of the language’s standards. Even the Germans are having quite difficulty trying to make their nouns more inclusive, since (like Spanish) most nouns are used in a “masculine is the standard” (for lack of a better description).
I swear I replied to this and then both my reply and your comment disappeared 🤷🏼♀️
Thank you for the explanation. Is “le” as an indirect object pronoun the same kind of gender neutral example? I’m really struggling with that atm. Every noun is going to be gendered except him and her?! I suck at languages.
Well, I’m no expert. I just enjoy learning languages and am a native Spanish speaker myself. With regards to the grammar I’m quit lost in my own language, but I can tell you this:
“le” is was and always has been neutral. It and the other examples I gave are just the basis that shows that Spanish is capable of implementing gender neutrality/equality.
I don’t know if you know any Spanish, but every single noun is already gendered. This is more about pronouns getting another third person singular pronoun, and also trying to expand the base of the language and noun or adjectives that are already gendered to include this gender neutrality + equality.
I hope I could answer your question properly, but of not, feel free to elaborate.
It was first seen in online queer activist circles around 2004. You can read a little about it here. Latino is traditionally masc/neutral but English style guides also said the same about “he” when referring to someone of unknown or unspecified gender for a long time, which has largely fallen out of use for singular “they” now.
Personally, I don’t use Latinx in writing to refer to all Latinos/Latinas as polling has shown only 2-3% of people readily identify with it. But I do think you absolutely should use it if that’s how someone personally identifies.
For some reason people get violently ill when they see someone use pronouns on the internet, so they came up with an alternative words so that their ideas match up with reality.
It’s coming around though. My gf watches a garbage amount of influencer bullshit, mostly mainstream streamers and such, and I’ve heard it quite a number of times.
Lol all of them. We in Mexico. You’d probably be surprised that lgbtq people exist here on huge and proud numbers. Or would you also just assume they’re white liberals cosplaying?
Thank you for not calling us LatinX, I’ve yet to meet a Latino who doesn’t hate that.
I’ve never understood LatinX. Is it supposed to be a gender neural Latino/Latina? I’m only a Spanish beginner but I’m fairly sure Latino can be masculine and gender neutral.
“LatinX” was indeed the first attempt at a gender neutral description. “Latino” is still considered by many native speakers to be “neutral”, but the most feasible solution I’ve seen popping up is the “latine” (as in “estudiante”, “vigilante”, etc). Since it uses an explicitly non-gendered suffix, it is more correctly inclusive than the “latino”. It will take a while though, und until it is really widely adopted.
So like, is there any sizeable Latin community actually calling for a gender neutral term or is this just a middle-class white people thing? Because as a white person I’ve never seen anyone push for this other than white people and it just seems like a white savior/ daddy knows best thing. But my experience is just my experience
There are some people who identify as Latinx. Pew puts it at 2-3% of Latin Americans, usually those who are non-binary.
I think the reason that it has the astroturfed white middle class vibe is that it’s really been pushed by corporate culture for whatever reason, who use it as catch all for all Latin Americans which clearly doesn’t line up with how the majority self-identify.
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I am trans and Latina and it is totally a thing. We have queer people too, we come in all the normal colors and a few weird ones too.
My experience is also your experience.
There is John Leguizamo, though it definitely feels like he’s trying to manage his waning popularity as a c-lister.
I never liked him much until he guest hosted the Daily Show earlier this year. He was terrific.
That is what I myself thought on the first place, but it’s more of a “global” movement. It’s not just “white people”, but rather also native Spanish speakers learning nuances of other languages, plus Gender Studies research, etc.
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I don’t know where you come from or what languages (apart from English) you might speak, but:
Hope that makes it clearer.
I swear I replied to this and then both my reply and your comment disappeared 🤷🏼♀️
Thank you for the explanation. Is “le” as an indirect object pronoun the same kind of gender neutral example? I’m really struggling with that atm. Every noun is going to be gendered except him and her?! I suck at languages.
Well, I’m no expert. I just enjoy learning languages and am a native Spanish speaker myself. With regards to the grammar I’m quit lost in my own language, but I can tell you this:
I hope I could answer your question properly, but of not, feel free to elaborate.
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If someone knows a YouTube video or something about this, I’d be interested.
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It was first seen in online queer activist circles around 2004. You can read a little about it here. Latino is traditionally masc/neutral but English style guides also said the same about “he” when referring to someone of unknown or unspecified gender for a long time, which has largely fallen out of use for singular “they” now.
Personally, I don’t use Latinx in writing to refer to all Latinos/Latinas as polling has shown only 2-3% of people readily identify with it. But I do think you absolutely should use it if that’s how someone personally identifies.
Am I the only one who reads LatinX as rhyming with larynx?
I read it as a Latino fetish porn site.
For some reason people get violently ill when they see someone use pronouns on the internet, so they came up with an alternative words so that their ideas match up with reality.
I’m not Latino, but I feel like that would annoy me. Latin@ as well. The language is gendered, trying to eliminate that is absurd.
I think it’s a generational thing because I remember the @ being more widely used in the 90s, especially when the internet cafés were getting popular.
It’s coming around though. My gf watches a garbage amount of influencer bullshit, mostly mainstream streamers and such, and I’ve heard it quite a number of times.
How many of them are actually Latino though? It seems like a term created and made popular by white liberals
Lol all of them. We in Mexico. You’d probably be surprised that lgbtq people exist here on huge and proud numbers. Or would you also just assume they’re white liberals cosplaying?
I’ve been told on the bird site that I’m just a white liberal cosplaying… But I’m very much latino. Lol
Yeah it sounds like something Musk would conjure up.
Rent free
cry
In support: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/latino-civil-rights-organization-drops-latinx-official-communication-rcna8203
LatinEs
Guácala, no. Prefiero mil veces latinx.
I’m a latinx who doesn’t hate latinx while living in a latinx country. It’s not popular, but we’re here.