Your Windows 10 PC will soon be ‘junk’ - users told to resist Microsoft deadline::If you’re still using Windows 10 and don’t want to upgrade to Windows 11 any time soon you might want to sign a new online petition
Nah fuck you, I’m staying with 10 as long as I can, then I’m switching to linux
My PC doesn’t hit the requirements for windows 11. Yet it kept asking me to update. Been running Ubuntu ever since
As I Linux user I can’t wait for the flood of cheap perfectly good hardware from these idiots
Bonus points is that they’ll probably be the last gasp of hardware consistently supporting S3 sleep too
Hey, can you elaborate? I switched my couple year old Windows 11 laptop to Linux a few months back, and no matter what I can’t get sleep to work. After doing research, apparently this is a common issue with Linux on laptops.
I eventually got hibernate to work, so I have it do that instead, but regular sleep would be nice…
Yep! So I can’t say necessarily what your specific problem is but it’s probably related to the big push towards “S0 Low Power Idle”, or “Modern Standby/Sleep”.
In a nutshell, MS and related peeps wanted to go after the always-connected, updated info, instant-on nature of the iPads and other mobile devices. I would guess Apple’s “Power Nap” functionality on their Mac was on their mind too. The effort resulted in the Windows 8-era Connected Standby as it was known then.
They have been pushing hard on S0 as the next version of sleep since. Who “they” is I am not entirely sure - it could be upstream at MS, Intel, most likely but the end result regardless is that OEM’s have been switching to Modern Standby.
But fortunately, some machines have a choice. My ThinkPad X1 Extreme Gen 4 has a BIOS toggle to switch between S0 and ol reliable S3 sleep (labeled Linux sleep) - no Windows re-installation needed despite the warning on it. Other machines might not like the XPS 9510 and Latitude 7210 2-in-1 I had previously. (I got rid of the former due to warranty issues and suspect build quality, the latter because I needed more oomph and less portability)
I was losing 8% battery an hour in the 7210 and I wasted hours troubleshooting only to find out that the M.2 drive I installed was somehow “not compatible” with Modern Standby, after that was sorted it was the only Modern Standby experience I had that was mostly acceptable.
My new work laptop is a ThinkPad T14 Gen 3 and there is no option to enable S3 so I am on that Modern Standby train involuntarily for this one. Anyways, after the battery reliably drained several times in a few hours of sleep, with the power light pulsing indicating it was sleeping - I was able to get the company service desk to enable my hibernate setting and I use that exclusively so I don’t have to keep it plugged in while traveling to save my state.
Sometimes that toggle is removed in a BIOS update so you’ll have to research that too, and what version to install if it occurs.
So yea, S3 is going out of fashion and taking reliable sleep with it. Lot of complaining out there about battery drain, overheating in bags, OEM’s recommend just using hibernate, Linus Tech Tips had a video ranting about switching to Macs over it and supposedly heard from an MS engineer but I don’t think Microsoft will be able to truly fix it, it’s been years.
If my laptop dies, I’ll probably get another like it or maybe take the opportunity to jump to a Steam Deck and maybe an ARM Mac. Not sure yet. When the time to jump to Linux comes in a couple years, maybe I’ll just get a desktop.
Oh wow, thanks for the in depth reply. Am I incorrect in assuming that they want the “Modern Standby” to be standard, because that mode means the device is always “connected” despite being asleep?
There must be a reason that a corporation would push for a seemingly inferior technology, and it’s basically 100% of the time about money.
I’m just speculating but I would say that’s “not wrong”.
The network connected part of Modern Standby can actually be disabled reasonably easily in command prompt and it does come up as a possible band-aid to battery drain issues. (In my applications it didn’t help a noticeable amount but at least it’s there.)
When Modern Standby works, it works… okay. I mentioned getting it working on my 7210 2-in-1 after swapping for a proper SSD (eyeroll) and while it still used more power than S3, I could live with 1-2% of battery loss in an hour a lot more easily than 7-10% and I leaned on hibernate more as well since so many of us have been burned by Modern Standby when it doesn’t work.
I’m sure that while having the user computer being connected more is a net positive for telemetry and data collection but I think the drive towards it is more of a semi-misguided effort to compete with the sheer instant-on, always-updated nature of smartphones, iPads, Android tablets, etc. much in the vein of how Windows has been pivoting left-and-right to fit onto tablets the past decade but not completely recognizing that people often use desktops and laptops differently.
So on paper it’s not inferior at all. Instant on, instant off, minimal power use increase, the computer can ring when calls are received, it can keep email up-to-date, sound alerts for reminders all while sleeping whereas it’s completely dead in S3 save for RAM being powered.
Sounds cool, it’s high-tech, I thought it was neat when I first heard about it especially since Apple’s Power Nap feature was around for years already and did nice housekeeping functions while the machine was sleeping - albeit within power use and thermal limits.
Microsoft and OEM’s just can’t seem to make it reliable enough to be the slam-dunk it theoretically can be nor do it’s benefits really shine in my use case since I sit down to use my Windows machines and nothing I use really can take advantage of Modern Standby. And since S3 is increasingly being pulled out, Linux has to deal with their shenanigans too.
Edit: Also I would expect ARM Windows machines to sleep better or at least be efficient enough to not worry, but I can’t say for sure.
Amen brother
Fun fact: Linux is so customizable that you can run a modern GUI and software on 46mb of ram and a CPU from 1989. Don’t let Microshit tell you to throw out your old PC, it’s truly surprising what’s possible.
So customizable that it can’t even be run on many devices.
Nah, fuck it, I’m switching to Linux.
Yep. Gaming is starting to work on Linux, so I will move to Linux once Microsoft cancels 10.
11 has nothing more than more telemetry and tracking going for it. Gaming is slower, so why would I upgrade for a worse experience.
I play old games still anyways. Linux is more secure than Windows 11 anyways. I won’t upgrade to 11, and turned off TPM in BIOS so 11 won’t automatically install.
Next computer of mine will definitely be running Linux. Only thing I’d ever need windows for is some oddly specific software that won’t work on Linux because I’m too dumb to get working properly.
please let me suck your dick integrally and immediately
These people… “please, let me continue being a Microsoft slave!”.
Free yourselves and install Linux.
I’m so sick of hearing this and I use Linux on a daily basis
Installing Linux for us nerds is just something we know how to do. Asking a computer “normie” (which is, basically everyone else) to change their operating system is just not happening.
I couldn’t imagine trying to step my mum through installing Linux if I stood next to her, and I wouldn’t class her as stupid.
I maintain that for Linux to obtain mass adoption it either needs to be preinstalled or make it no different to install than a regular Windows program (which is damn near impossible).
Nah fam, mint’s a gamechanger
My 11 year old son does his homework and research on Linux Mint. After that, he sometimes plays some Minecraft or Valheim with his friends or does some drawings on his graphics tablet and listens to music or audio drama on Deezer. What else does your mom, that she cannot use Linux Mint?
The main point of the comment seems to be that his mother, who represents a demographic, would have trouble removing an OS from a machine replacing it with Linux.
This literally has nothing to do with what the previous poster said.
My soon to be 4 year old is getting really good with the mouse and keyboard so we intend to set her up with her first computer for Christmas. I’ve got an old Lenovo Tiny with an i5-6500 and 8gb of RAM that I snagged from the junk pile at work that I’m going to setup with Mint or even just plain Ubuntu. I’m curious to see how long that PC lasts before we have to swap it out for something more powerful. Probably whenever she starts playing more demanding games that aren’t just running from PBSkids.org
Just follow the handy dandy Microsoft guide to installing Linux https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/linux/install
But seriously. Yes, it’s true that installing a new OS is a level of effort the average person is unlikely to want to put in. But they’re going to have to start because I believe the situation this Windows monopoly is causing is far worse than it appears on the surface.
It’s estimated that around half of PCs in the world won’t be able to run Windows 11 https://www.computerworld.com/article/3657628/more-than-half-of-pcs-cant-upgrade-to-windows-11-report.html
Sure, a good chunk of those machines probably can’t even run Windows 10. They’ll still be on earlier versions of Windows, even going back as far as XP in some cases.
Because of the “latest Windows” benchmark PCs depreciate only slightly slower than bananas. Part of the reason I got into Linux as a young and poor nerd was because it could run on much older and significantly cheaper hardware. But most people and organisations aren’t going to bother trying to resell their computers for the measly sum they’d get when they bite the bullet and upgrade, adding millions of still perfectly usable machines to the ever building toxic soup of e-waste and using more resources than necessary when creating new Windows compatible devices.
On top of that those who are unable or unwilling to upgrade end up with an OS full of more holes than swiss cheese that diminishes cyber security for everyone.
At this point, not switching to Linux (which is really the only viable Windows alternative) and getting the longest lifespan possible out of your hardware in a safe way is frankly irresponsible.
I think this is ultimately Microsoft being irresponsible, because most people will either stick with the then insecure Windows 10, or just buy a new device that can take Windows 11. Most would rather do either of those than install Linux, if they even know about Linux at all.
I switched from Win 10 to Ubuntu this year. The Ubuntu installer was easy as hell. I’d argue easier than windows.
It got tricky when I needed the non-latest CUDA drivers for pytorch fun, but most folks won’t be doing development.
Also, most folks don’t install windows. They’ll give it to their nerd nephew or their local Compu-Hut.
My biggest gripe is Snaps can make for confusing permission bullshit when saving files or using the clipboard, but this isnt a debate about snaps… the installer is great
Most people don’t install windows or ask a family member or friend to do it for them, they buy a device that has windows already on it. The number of people who put windows on a device themselves is a miniscule fraction of windows users
You’re right. Over the years, I’ve installed various kinds of Windows for relatives, and various Linux distros for myself and my wife. I’ve found, particularly in recent years, Linux is easier to install and more straightforward. Yeah, I’m an experienced user, so it’s fairly easy for me and not intimidating, but I can’t see a Linux installation as more difficult to install compared to Windows.
Most users, as you say, don’t install an OS themselves, which applies to both Windows, Mac and Linux.
The installation has always been easy enough for me, but what I struggle with is updating drivers and installing new software. Granted, I’m not the brightest bulb in the box, so there’s that. I did really like the insane variety of distros and all the needs they cater to. Like if there’s something specific you need your OS to specialize in, there’s probably a Linux distro for it.
I disagree with this because for 20 years both the Ubuntu and Debian GUI installer ran like a practical joke from hell. Even Linus himself said he couldn’t get it to work. Only Debian really improved while Ubuntu continues to somehow explode every time I try it
Every other distro besides hardcore ones like Gentoo and Arch have pretty basic installers that greatly outshine the crappy windows 8/10/11 setup screen.
Fedora has an auto installer tool so all you really need is a USB and not some magic funky thing called rufus.
There’s even entire DE setups dedicated to looking and functioning exactly like windows to the point that the average person wouldn’t even recognize nor care to know the difference.
Yes actually getting someone to replace an OS is hard no matter how easy you make it because it involves doing something unknown or new. But by the same token, we used to run DOS and install windows from floppy disks like it was no big deal back before windows owned the desktop market. Talk to anyone who was a college student in the 90s and they’ll probably recognize the word UNIX, even in unrelated non CS fields.
How is this going to help his mom install linux?
Did you open the page? It answers your question. And if it doesn’t then this video will https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7CqDCw8mPQ
TL;DR (even if you’d get it in 3 minutes) it makes installing ubuntu as easy as installing an application on windows.
It’s not that simple for gamers.
Are you stuck in 2015?
What do you mean bro? Linux runs a shit ton of games and some even better than windows.
It depends on the type of games you play. If you’re more like me and you enjoy playing single-player games, then yeah you’re all set. If all you play is Valorant and Fortnite and PUBG and League of Legends, you’re much more likely to have a hard time. Anticheats are a special kind of evil.
I thought not supporting Windows rootkits is a positive for Linux?
BTW, LoL is playable!
My fiancée’s games all run much better on Debian (with KDE) than on Windows.
The only modern games I’ve ever had issues with were a few select DX12 games (and that’s due to my GPU). Outside of that, some old games outside of Steam game me trouble, but that’s usually just a matter of fiddling with some settings in Lutris. Even then, those are usually games that also have trouble on modern Windows versions, and they often require less tweaking on Linux to get them running.
Not until game companies embrace Proton(-GE) and Steam Deck.
ok
K
The day i had ads on my start page i immidiately uninstalled windows. I installed some linux distro its been like three years and ive finally settled on arch. it was hard but fuck ads on the start page and i feel smarter for it
When you swap distros, how do you manage all your files and settings? Do you just save your files externally and start from scratch every time you change a distro?
how do you manage all your files and settings?
I don’t. I just use a separate drive for /home. And since I just prefer KDE no matter which system I’m using, all my files, settings, layouts, panels, etc are exactly the same whenever I switch out the OS.
You can have a separate partition for your files so that you change only your OS. Even with windows. This way you’ll always keep your files and just need to customize your distro and reinstall your apps when you change between distros
Typically your personal files and app settings are stored somewhere in your user home folder, eg under
/home/bob/. Ideally you’ve set up your system in a way so that the entire/home/folder is stored on its own disk or partition at least. That let’s you boot up a different distro while using the same home directory. But even if you haven’t set it up separately from the rest of the system, you can still manually copy all those files.Not every single application setting is transferable between distros as they sometimes use different versions but generally it works well. Many apps also let you manually export profiles or settings and reimport them elsewhere later. Or they have online synchronization baked in.
Yeah i kept my files on a seperate drive and just wiped the one with the os. for settings i was trying a different distro and desktop enviroment so those where always a bit different and i started from scratch
ive finally settled on arch.
What are you, some kind of Linux prodigy?
arch is basic. It’s just minimalise by default.
It has an amazing wiki, extremely active and helpful user forums, and an installer (i think now) or at least a massively helpfully customised shell for initial setup.
you can install arch and make it look like mint or whatever easily, then the only difference is pacman and the amazing AUR
Lol i hear this alot about arch users and as a newbie i dont get it. It has been the easiest for me to understand, maybe its the documentation idk i started with endavourOS as well which is a great beginner OS for arch IMO
EndeavourOS isn’t pure arch. (I don’t mean this in an elitist way. Use whatever is best for you.) Pure arch doesn’t come with a desktop, so it sucks for new users.
EndeavorOS has been a great experience for me as well. Also KDE Plasma and now Wayland.
I started with an Arch-based distro and haven’t looked back (EndeavorOS). I have a family member that has been daily driving Linux for over a decade, so that was very helpful during the transition. But after a week or two, I haven’t needed his help at all.
My laptop that previously ran Windows 11 is faster than ever.
There is no way they don’t offer extended support for Windows 10. Many PCs can’t get to windows 11. Imagine all the malware infected machines that will be out there.
I assume eventually they’ll drop the UEFI security requirement, which is why 90% of the “can’t” cases occur.
My Windows install is still in compatibility mode. It’s the sole reason I can’t upgrade to 11, not that I want to. I can’t be bothered to reinstall Windows on UEFI when there’s no point anyway. I’ll happily stick to 10.
Microsoft products are all about getting infected with malware. That’s the whole point of this company.
Dude what ad ridden hellscape is that site, ublock pinged 45 ads on that page just on load lol
Oh that’s just the start menu
Third-party scripts disabled and it loads instantly, no ads. Funny that.
yea it was overkill enough to make me look into if connect supports always opening links external so I can have my ad block lol
I often play old games that have compatibility issues with windows 10. Most recently FEAR required a .dll from a site for a stable framerate.
People keep saying “gaming works” on Linux but are they talking about modern games? Do old games “just work?” I have very little free time to fart about with fixing too many issues with an old game. How well does this stuff work?
Check protondb for reports on whether a specific (steam) game runs.
In my experience, pretty much everything that doesn’t have anticheat works. I can’t remember the last time a game didn’t work fine, from stuff so old it stopped working in Windows Vista to day 1 AAA titles. Even DOS stuff is playable with DOSBox.
Just be aware, Linux is not windows. If you try to use it like windows, you will only experience pain. It’s not hard, especially with mainstream distros like Ubuntu or Mint, but you really should invest at least a bit of effort into learning how the system works and how to use it properly.
Proton is amazing. There are several games I’ve played on my Linux laptop that have Linux versions, and they don’t run as well as playing it with Proton.
I would say old games work better also get Steamtinkerlaunch which makes fucking around easy
If the game isnt steam just add as non steam game and bang steam will handle the rest
I had great experiences with old games on Linux. Mostly they work better than on a modern Windows system. For Example Neverwinter Nights 2. Under Windows movement is jittery on fast CPUs. There is a community patch for that thankfully. Under Linux it just works with WINE (the patch is advisable for other reasons there too). Also loading times are blazingly fast under WINE and Linux. On my HDD PC 1 second vs 50 on Windows. Now with a NVME SSD, Windows also only takes 2 seconds.
Of course Wine/Proton is not perfect, I still have a dualboot system for that. But I boot to Windows very rarely these days. When I do I am hit with so many slow updates, that I don’t get to my game. Maybe I should stop doing them and cut of its network access.
Really old games tend to be more difficult. For a relative I set up a VM with Win98 as the performance impact won’t hurt the games, some even benefit. (I believe the games where Safecracker and Theme Park) Even older than that DosBox and ScummVM work perfectly.
As long as the game isn’t a title thats using something bleeding edge, it will work day one. And as long as the game isn’t using an non proton compatible anti-cheat, it should work. Unless said devs arbitrarily decided not to tick the “proton compatible” box cause of some hard-headed bullshit.
Once ALVR becomes even remotly usable on Linux im wiping my windows partition and going full Linux (I’m already using it for everything exept VR)
It sounds like they have beta support for Linux, so it seems like it’s getting there.
Your PC will soon be be junk if you do not want to try out Linux.
Your PC is already junk if it runs Windows. But you can easily fix that.
The real problem is when Steam drops support on W10…
That petition and a nickel is worth about 5 cents. Go get a better OS.
Which is almost anything else at this point.
That just means more cheap, used hardware available for us Linux users in a couple years.
Wait windows 10 was not junk before? Since when?
